DCA, Future Expansion
Topic: Ratatouille Coaster

#	Author	Message
81	davewasbaloo Tue 10/16/2007 12:16a	>>>There was nothing (activities, restaurants outside of hotels, etc.) available for anyone staying on those hotels to occupy the guests.<<< This is also not true. Festival Disney opened Apr 12, 1992 (I was there) with the shops, Buffalo Bill's wild West Show, Centre Stage, Rock n Roll America, Annette's, Billy Bob's, the Steakhouse, NY Deli, the Sports Bar, LA Bar and Grill, Hurricanes, and Key West Restaurant. Back then we stayed on site and did not leave (like many others), and now it is the same for many visitors. I know very few brits who stay in Paris, they all stay in the Val de Europe region. Many of you guys ar speculators. Knowing how poor the US media is, unless you were in Europe you do not know the pains of the recession in the late 80's, early 90's. About 40% of people in the UK lost their homes. In the rest of Europe, it was not quite as bad, but it het hard. And EDL opened about 18 months later. Ecnomically speaking, it was far worse than the post 9?11 economic downturn in the US. No one would have seen it when building EDL as Europe was very prosperous in the 80's - the EDL business model made sense. Then, despite people strugglin to put food on their tables, add in the fact that transport from the UK to DLP was only about 20% cheaper than going to the states (no budget airlines back then, or the rate drops on the trains we have seen over the last 10 years). And once you got there, the accommodation, food and drink were far more expensive than in the States. Mix in rioting farmers blockading the roads to the resort with burning hay and manure. Well, it's not surprising the resort did not initially do well. I went opening weekend, and again in June 1992, and I am sure in relative terms, the resort is much cheaper today then back then. After all a school day trip in a bus cost $500 in 1992 - that would be like spending $1200 for a day today!
82	jonvn Tue 10/16/2007 8:32a	You really think Spain would have been worse? I know it's a lot hotter there. But I find it hard to believe that they'd be more hostile than the french.
83	jonvn Tue 10/16/2007 8:33a	"unless you were in Europe you do not know the pains of the recession in the late 80's, early 90's" I alluded to that in mentioning the bottom dropping out of the real estate market.
84	Sport Goofy Tue 10/16/2007 9:45a	EDL's problems are not "French" problems. The park draws from far more countries than just France. Some of the workforce and political issues are "French," but not the biggest issues. There is nothing inherently wrong with having a park in France. When Disney did the market research for a park in Europe there were a number of sites considered. Sites in Spain ranked highly because of the weather and established travel patterns for vacationers from the north who already made trips to the Mediterranean coast for holidays. The market in France was geared more towards day or weekend visitors. Yet, they built a facility that seemed to cater to the vacation/resort market -- wrong location for that market. The kicker that made the final decision for Disney was the economic concessions by the French government. If not for those, EDL would likely have been located in Spain since that is where the market research showed vacation trends would match the WDW business model the closest. While DLR is a bustling theme park, it has nowhere near the margins of WDW and Disney isn't setting out to populate the world with DLR-style parks that only attract locals, day-trippers, and weekend tourists.
85	Spirit of 74 Tue 10/16/2007 9:53p	<<even with lavish e-tickets and a better second park I just don't think the french would visit the resort more. I wish they would just shut down the whole paris resort and ship whatever they can to the parks in California, Florida, and Japan. >> That really is an incredibly ignorant statement to make. Have you been there?
86	Spirit of 74 Tue 10/16/2007 9:58p	<<I think people just like to hate the French because they are so very French.>> I agree. I also feel politics plays a part. The French don't always agree with the way the USA conducts itself on the international stage and isn't afraid to say so. So we get 'freedom fries' and people pouring French wine down sewers. FWIW, I was so afraid of the French and Parisians especially after hearing for years about how 'they hate Americans ... they're so rude etc ...' I found the opposite to be true. Almost everyone we met on three visits in the past 18 months was wonderful. Really terrific people. The fact most French hate George Bush shouldn't be confused with them hating Americans because it just isn't true.
87	Skellington88 Tue 10/16/2007 10:16p	<That really is an incredibly ignorant statement to make. Have you been there?> It was a silly statement I admit and no I have not been there although im familar with the park through video, books, etc. I just don't think Disney parks work well in foriegn countries (Japan being the exception) just look at paris and hong kong. It would be an even bigger disaster if they built parks in shangi hi and india.
88	Spirit of 74 Tue 10/16/2007 10:29p	Disney parks have done very well everywhere but Hong Kong ... and I believe that park will do fine too as soon as they actually put attractions into it. From what I know, it is a very detailed, beautiful little park in an amazing setting with loads of space for expansion. Look for my trip report this spring :-) But you really should visit DLP before judging it. The place is really amazing. And even DSP, which is the worst Disney park I've ever been to, has four (maybe more with Crush's Coaster open) very good attractions (three that are unique to that park). Visit ... then see what you believe.
89	2001DLFan Tue 10/16/2007 10:42p	<<Skellington88: I just don't think Disney parks work well in foriegn countries (Japan being the exception) just look at paris and hong kong. It would be an even bigger disaster if they built parks in shangi hi and india.>> Considering that Hong Kong Disneyland is the only one with real issues, it's hard to claim that foreign parks don't work. The only other park with issues is Disney Studio Paris. But in that case, the first gate: Disneyland Paris is very successful. The only reasons those parks are having problems is because of shortsighted investment and flawed overall concepts. Disney's focus on international growth appears to indicate they might go into Singapore and India. Hopefully they'll get their financial and creative act together before venturing there. They don't need any more mistakes like DCA, DSP and HK.
90	jeffshultz Fri 11/2/2007 2:38p	I went to EuroDisney in... must have been mid '91 or so. Maybe 92 - after spending 5 years in Germany the early ones tend to blur together. I did it on a two day Paris bus tour - one day in Paris, one day at EuroDisney. The park was interesting, but I definitely missed the E-ticket rides (like Space Mountain) that weren't there. It was definitely a bit different having Tomorrowland take on a definite Jules Verne "1880s" flavor instead of the "whitewashed NASA" look of DL Tomorrowland of the late 70s to 80s that I was used to. One thought I had about it was that they built too far outside of Paris. I'd never been to WDW, but I knew that Disneyland benefited from having the life support of the Anaheim/OC/LA area _right there_. Sounds like the problems related to the rail service shutting down too early just amplified that. Oh - one other thing that was a bit annoying - even though the park had been open for some time, there was a lot of stuff there that wasn't multi-lingual yet - and even in Europe that can be a killer. Despite their famed (and inaccurate) arrogance about everyone knowing multiple languages, not having at least English, Spanish and German (Italian is close enough to Spanish and French to work it out, from what I've been told) in addition to French just made things more difficult than they needed to be. Especially with narrated stuff.

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