DCA, Future Expansion
Topic: Little mermaid ride...NOT happening?

#	Author	Message
41	boyumz Wed 4/2/2008 7:37a	Yeah, that last sentence was really ignorant and offensive. I hope it was just a bad attempt at a joke.
42	Witches of Morva Thu 4/3/2008 10:25a	ORDDU: Actually, there have been some reports about various secret societies out there who are not what they appear to be. But if we were to continue any discussions about all that, we'd have to move to World Events. I'm sure BlueOhannaTerror wasn't meaning to be offensive, by the way.
43	BlueOhanaTerror Thu 4/3/2008 11:49a	>>>Yeah, that last sentence was really ignorant and offensive. I hope it was just a bad attempt at a joke.<<< It wasn't ignorant at all, but I grant that it's offensive. It was an attempt at a chuckle. Having done extensive research into Masonic writings and other secret societies, and having had to document and cross-reference endless sources, I can assure you at the heart of FreeMasonry's oldest writings is the veneration of "Lucifer" - not "Jesus" or "God" - as the ultimate Divine Authority. Whether that's practiced or not TODAY, in secret (or otherwise), it IS a documented element of their most official guiding and defining texts. My guess is that most orders of Masonry, except in perhaps some very creepy parts of the country, don't venerate Lucifer as God at all. You can't have "Masons" if you don't acknowledge that they have some wacky ancient texts that nobody wants to admit exist. The expectation, for instance, requiring that breaking an oath made to the Masons is penalized by having your tongue cut out. Some crazy stuff... and not that hard to find. Just look up the official texts in your local library. The Scientologists don't want to admit publicly to Xenu and their wacky stuff either, or that they encourage members to separate themselves from their families. Nevertheless, this is part and parcel of secret societies.
44	9oldmen Thu 4/3/2008 3:49p	Isn't there rumor about Walt Disney being a Mason? Also, according to a VERY unofficial source, the novel "The Davinci Code", he may have been a member of the Priory of Scion. This almost gets us back on topic. If anyone has read the book, there is something that Robert Langdon says about Disney's "Little Mermaid", and about the two main female characters (Ariel and Ursula) being symbolic of the "Grail". But like I said, a very unofficial source if ever there was one. Not likely to be something anyone will be thinking of while on the ride. But if your a hardcore "Mermaid" fan, you should check out the book (not the movie. It's not mentioned there), to see what it says. Dan Brown(the author) also get into why Langdon wears a "Mickey" watch.
45	DouglasDubh Thu 4/3/2008 5:04p	<I can assure you at the heart of FreeMasonry's oldest writings is the veneration of "Lucifer" - not "Jesus" or "God" - as the ultimate Divine Authority.> That's simply nonsense. Although we don't refer to Jesus in Blue Lodge, we do refer to God, and many Christians are Masons, and many Masons are Christians. I can't attest to this first hand, but I have been told that there are many Christian references in the York Rite branch of Masonry.
46	DouglasDubh Thu 4/3/2008 5:06p	<Isn't there rumor about Walt Disney being a Mason?> Walt was a Senior DeMolay, but not a Mason. DeMolay is an organization for boys that is sponsored by the Masons.
47	BlueOhanaTerror Thu 4/3/2008 11:58p	>>><I can assure you at the heart of FreeMasonry's oldest writings is the veneration of "Lucifer" - not "Jesus" or "God" - as the ultimate Divine Authority.> That's simply nonsense. Although we don't refer to Jesus in Blue Lodge, we do refer to God, and many Christians are Masons, and many Masons are Christians. I can't attest to this first hand, but I have been told that there are many Christian references in the York Rite branch of Masonry.<<< Hardly utter nonsense at all. If you study the Official Texts/Guide to the beliefs of Freemasonry from the mid-19th Century, you will find that the "Source of All Light" is defined not as the Hebrew God, or Jesus Christ, but is referred to as Lucifer. The Masons DO have many, many Christians, and I don't mean to claim that current masons, or even any significant number of PAST Masons, worship(ped) Lucifer. But it is there, in the texts. Dig in and find it. It's all there. I had to read and study this stuff myself for a very exhaustive comparative study of cults and secret societies. And no, I'm not equating the two - but both harbor secrets, both enjoy secret texts or texts that are largely ignored or unknown by their membership. Most people have no idea what their secret society (or cult, whatever the case might be) believes in its ENTIRETY, or what their history might contain. Especially if we're talking about texts that are over 150 years old. No utter nonsense. Just do the research into the works of some of the most formative Masons in America's history. You'll find some stunners. Scary stunners. But they're stunners that no sane person is going to follow for any length of time, or take seriously. It's akin to the window dressing at Halloween. Nobody takes that stuff seriously. You just have to laugh and wink at it all. But it's most definitely there.
48	DouglasDubh Fri 4/4/2008 12:27a	I've done the research. What you are saying is untrue. Washington, Hancock, Franklin and John Jay did not refer to God as Lucifer.
49	Britain Fri 4/4/2008 9:04a	Couldn't it possibly be that you are taking the meaning of the name "Lucifer" - which is "Light Bearer" - out of context? Only after his rebellion did he become a fallen angel known as Satan or the Devil.
50	BlueOhanaTerror Fri 4/4/2008 11:05a	>>>I've done the research. What you are saying is untrue. Washington, Hancock, Franklin and John Jay did not refer to God as Lucifer.<<< You have clearly NOT done the research if you're referring to texts by Washington, et al. The texts from the mid NINETEENTH century, as I said, not mid-EIGHTEENTH century, while including some typical Christian references, and mentioning "God" - do indeed explain that the ultimate deity is named "Lucifer". Wow, if I have to go into my files and dig this stuff up... And thanks, Britain, but believe me, I know what I speak of here. And this is exactly what's interesting about the detail - this author, one of the great leaders of Freemasonry and one of their great scribes, used the term "LUCIFER" for exactly that reason - because it is the name "pre-fall". If they'd used the name "Satan" - that would have been the end of Freemasonry right there. As it is, those passages have clearly fallen into such obscurity, that their membership 1) isn't even aware of this detail in their history and 2) would never EMBRACE such a tenet. Why they even bothered to "go there" on the record, who knows. But it's in those texts. And it should also be known there's a TON of stuff that Masons and other secret societies are not permitted to utter/reveal in public, as sharing those things with non-members is punishable (at least according to the texts) in some of the most severe ways one could imagine. Akin to the types of things one would expect from radical terrorist groups today. And THOSE things DID slip out, and they're a matter of record, very easily accessed. I think, like the widespread bigamy and "hit squads" appropriated by Mormonism's oldest leaders, that these are things that modern Masons would rather not think about (nor appropriate). Let's just say we all grew up and leave it at that.

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