World Events
Topic: Gay Marriage Ban Overturned by CA Supreme Court

#	Author	Message
121	beamerdog Fri 5/16/2008 5:17p	Mele, maybe that means two bisexual people married to each other? Oh, wait, that only works if they are of the opposite sex. I guess if 2 bisexual men marry or 2 bisexual women marry, then that's a bi-gayexual marriage? In the words of another poster, my head is starting to hurt.
122	X-san Fri 5/16/2008 5:57p	Ob brother. I got ADMINED cause I joked that WorldDisney was gay? Come on, guys. We're buds, you don't know that!? (or maybe it was WD would complained :p)
123	SingleParkPassholder Fri 5/16/2008 6:03p	"Sorry if I'm being dense here, but if this is based on a "fundamental right" in the state Constitution, why can't the voters amend the Constitution itself to remove that right? If they put the ban into the Constitution, how can it be unconstitutional? That's the part I'm confused about." To put it plainly, a fundamental right is one you're born with, like the right to vote, marry or procreate. States cannot restrict rights enumerated in the Federal Constitution, only expand on them. So, in this case, if eventually the United States Supreme Court finds that gays enjoy the same fundamental right to marry as straights do, no state can ever ban it. So, until the USSC rules on it, in California, since the state Supremes have said a ban is unconstitutional because it affects a fundamental right, any initiative that does so will be struck down. Where the anti crowd thinks they can win is by some clever writing of an initiative, but if the end result is the same, to me it's a monumental waste of time and money.
124	Elderp Fri 5/16/2008 7:05p	The USSC circumvented this one awhile back ago when they said marriage is a state's right issue.
125	barboy Fri 5/16/2008 7:45p	///Ob brother. I got ADMINED cause I joked that WorldDisney was gay? Come on, guys. We're buds, you don't know that!?/// I think people around here are becoming hypersensitive. There has been some red lines over trivial things. I just got tagged over "getting laid on the beach" in WDW section. So now I guess sex on the beach is a no no but it is ok to get drunk on the beach. If you ask me both sound good. Whatever.
126	DAR Fri 5/16/2008 9:15p	<<maybe that means two bisexual people married to each other>> Bisexual's now there's some issues. Just a pick a side and get it over with. ;P
127	WorldDisney Fri 5/16/2008 9:20p	<<Ob brother. I got ADMINED cause I joked that WorldDisney was gay? Come on, guys. We're buds, you don't know that!? (or maybe it was WD would complained :p)>> Wow, seriously!! You got admind for that?? Maybe it had something else to do with the transexual hookers you mentioned too ;). Eitherway, if it was to protect me, none needed lol. Especially since I took that same post and quoted in my own so OBVIOUSLY it doesn't bother me ;). So, you ARE Mr. X, X-san? Ah, I was wondering why this poster was so good at getting in everybody's face lol.
128	WorldDisney Fri 5/16/2008 9:25p	Woah, wait a second, now **I'M** angry >:(. My post was admined as well in #100, after I took nearly 40 minutes writing it. What the hell did I say that was so defensive??? Anyone who knows me here knows I'm careful. What, because I jotted down all the issues of marriage and society and made the point gay marriage wouldn't be mocking the institution anymore than it's been mocked and soiled for decades now anyway? I have to believe it's more than that, but its just a reminder why I limit my time on LP these days. Oh well, guess its time to take off again, it was nice posting here for a little while, see you guys.
129	RoadTrip Fri 5/16/2008 10:12p	<<There are many people who come by their view honestly, and aren't necessarily bigots, no matter what informs their opinion, be it religion or an honest philosophical difference of opinion. I'm no stranger to shouting matches around here, but this issue is so important, let's not muck it up.>> I agree. For some people there is absolutely no problem with gay people, no problem with a committed relationship between gays, no problem with a gay couple in a committed relationship having every single right that a married heterosexual couple has. For them it is a purely definitional thing. Kind of like calling the children you are raising from a spouses former marriage step-children rather than just children. Truly, what the heck difference does it make? But it is a definitional thing, and some folks have a real hard time changing definitions. It is not always based in malice. For a long time I thought that gay people should have legally recognized committed relationships, but wasn't sure it should be called marriage. Kind of the same thing as the difference between kids and step-kids. Should marriage remain a term for a male-female relationship just as children, as opposed to step-children, are by definition the offspring (natural or adopted) of only the married couple? I changed my view on gay marriage not because I had any great epiphany, but because I came to know several gay couples as friends and found that being able to have their relationship recognized as "marriage" was very important to them. That was enough for me... when I saw the importance it had for them the whole definition issue just faded away. So before we are too tough on folks like Josh, I think it is good to consider the possibility that there is no malice behind his thoughts -- just an uncertainty about definitions. :-)
130	gadzuux Sat 5/17/2008 12:09a	I couldn't resist. I have to post a link to my favorite columnist in the SF chronicle - mark morford - you know him, you love him. He weighed in on the whole topic today in his inimitable prose. http://www.sfgate.com/columnis...morford/ Coupla excerpts to give you the gist ... ----------------------------------------- COURT APPROVES EVIL GAY AGENDA We are all going to die. Very, very soon. Did you know? Apparently, the signs are all in place and the plague is clearly nigh and Armageddon is fast upon us because, oh my angry heterosexual god, the announcement has now been handed down: Couples who deeply love one another may now get married in California. It's true. Wait, there's more. The couple in question might both have penises. Or they both might not. This is the crazy, terrifying new thing: It is totally up to them. Can you imagine? Here's the problem: despite the tears of joy flooding through the gay community and despite the soothing gobs of liberal bliss pouring like warm honey over tens of thousands -- the armies of right-wing darkness are screaming their dread, scraping their nails on the chalkboard of fear, rallying the bitterly faithful. Oh yes they are. This is the bad news. As you read these very words, shrill cultural conservatives from Orange County to Fresno to Stockton are holding meetings in all sorts of grungy subbasements and moldy rec rooms and sterile Holiday Inn conference rooms, sipping watery Sanka and sweating profusely in their armpits and scowling like angry cats as they work to put a quick and painful stop to all this gay-loving God-hating nonsense, by way of an initiative on the November ballot outlawing icky and confusing gay marriage, by constitutional decree, once and for all. See? Same as it ever was: One beautiful step forward, one giant jackboot back. Or is it? This is the big question now facing the intelligent and sex-positive world: Can they succeed? Will the forces of religious righteousness and repressed sexuality and violent Biblical misunderstanding be able to pull one last Rove-like maneuver out of the hat of conservative hate? Put more simply: Are the farm-belt minions still sufficiently scared of happy gay people in love? It might not be such an easy trick this time. This is the good news. It is the twilight of the Bush Endtimes and the right wing hate machine is no longer the nasty Hummer of bloviated pain it once was. What's more, there's this pesky thing known as a $3 trillion war. There is brutal economic recession. There is environmental collapse. Really, who cares about happy gay people getting married when it costs 4 bucks a gallon to get to Wal-Mart? Priorities, people. A powerhouse seven-member Supreme Court -- six of whom are moderate Repubicans -- of the largest and most potent state in the union says, hey, you know what? It appears we've had it wrong all along. It appears there is actually nothing the slightest bit wrong or unlawful or even dangerous about allowing people of the same gender to buy overpriced formalwear and drink way too much champagne and dance to crappy '80s power ballads in the Chardonnay Room of a low-rent winery up in Napa, and call it a wedding. Who can argue with that? Hell, to this very day, cultural conservatives still have no idea exactly why they hate gay marriage. There is still zero articulation. There is a complete lack of fact or understanding and I have yet to meet a single person of any political stripe who can adequately explain exactly why gay marriage is so dangerous, or who's threatened, or how. Same as it ever was? Yes. Only now, their misunderstanding feels quite a bit less dangerous, and far more pathetic. Which means the only ones left still scowling, still bitter and miserable and unhappy about it all, are the ones who never understood much about love and progress in the first place. What a shame. They're gonna miss one hell of a reception.

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