World Events
Topic: Gay Marriage Ban Overturned by CA Supreme Court

#	Author	Message
391	mele Fri 5/30/2008 4:19p	<<So are we saying a marriage license is the right to perform the ceremony? >> What? I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying there. Churches will always have criteria that couples must meet before the church will marry them. That's fine. It's that way right NOW for straight couples. That's the churches business. The government should give licenses and let couples go where they will to have their ceremonies They can go to civil servants or people who have been ordained, etc, the same people who perform marriages now. Gays deserve equality at the govermental level but churches can do what they will. That's what I meant. The govt. should issue the licenses and amazingly, couples will find the right person (or church) to marry them. It doesn't have to be this huge issue about the church having one definition and the state having another. It's quite silly but some people seem bent on making the issue far more complicated than it needs to be. << The problem again here to me is that I think there are other legal venues for those rights. >> It's not ONLY about that but those are very important. It would take hours and hours and quite a lot of money to set up these rights only to STILL have them challenged much easier than a simple marriage license. That's where the love and commitment part comes in. If gays are truly treated equally in our society, they shouldn't have to jump through 1,000 different hoops just to have the same thing that straight people get simply because they are straight and have $64 (the cost for a marriage license in my state). No one is saying you can't have your beliefs about marriage, Elderp. I disagree with some of your views and that's fine. It's when you vote to make people live up to YOUR idea of marriage when it truly has no effect on your own life that makes it...cruel.
392	DAR Tue 6/3/2008 6:27a	Enough of the legalese talk. How the Church views it. This person is against it, that one is for it. These are the questions I want to when it comes to gay marriage. 1. Who does the proposing, can it be either person? 2. Does both men get separate bachelor or both women separate bachelorette parties? 3. Who's big day is it? When it's a man and woman we know it's the woman's day.
393	X-san Tue 6/3/2008 6:46a	Way to add some more smallmindedness to the conversation as usual, DAR. I suppose you were trying to be funny, but it's not that funny. Wanna know why I care so much about the legalization here? Because I have these friends. They were together for some 8 years, and one of them got very sick. The extremely hateful and prejudiced parents of the sick one forbid the other to discuss the medical situation with the docs, or even to enter the room of the sick one those last couple of weeks (against my sick friends' express wishes, but he was in no shape to voice them there at the end). And he died. I had to deal with my other friend and the grief he went through and the fact that society, those hateful parents, the hospital, and the law made things a HUNDRED times worse. This issue is no joke to me.
394	DAR Tue 6/3/2008 6:55a	<<Way to add some more smallmindedness to the conversation as usual, DAR.>> Way to be your usual holier than thou self.
395	BlueDevilSF Tue 6/3/2008 7:19a	^^^ Well, see, the people who are against same-sex marriage don't really care about that and will tell you that there are all sorts of legal avenues to take in order to ensure something like this doesn't happen. The question is: Why should we have to? Luckily I have a supportive family who won't question or challenge what we've set up, but we still have issues with some of our medical professionals in regarding us and treating us as a couple who, for all intents and purposes, set up the same legal rights straight couples take for granted. Somehow, though, I don't think it will amount to a hill of beans if/when we have a medical emergency. I mean, what do we do: Carry notarized copies of papers at all times to prove our rights? How stupid.
396	BlueDevilSF Tue 6/3/2008 7:20a	395 for 393.
397	X-san Tue 6/3/2008 7:22a	***Way to be your usual holier than thou self.*** No, DAR, only holier than you.
398	BlueDevilSF Tue 6/3/2008 7:23a	Oh, and another thing: Sad but true, the same-sex marriage opponents will never, ever see the human side of this issue. There is no compassion on their part.
399	X-san Tue 6/3/2008 7:24a	***I mean, what do we do: Carry notarized copies of papers at all times to prove our rights? How stupid.*** Actually, a transsexual friend of mine carries paperwork all the time (not sure if it's notarized or not...maybe so) just in case some angry cop decides to arrest her in the ladies room. Weird world, this.
400	Dabob2 Tue 6/3/2008 11:43a	Actually, X-san, I didn't see DAR's questions as smallminded. I'm willing to take them as genuine curiosity. They may (or may not) be rooted in a misperception some straight folks have, i.e. "which one of you is the girl?" Of course, it doesn't work that way - we're both men and glad to be so, thank you. But if they were asked in the spirit of genuine curiosity - like respectfully asking one of our Mormon LP'ers what a "temple recommend" is, for instance - here goes: <1. Who does the proposing, can it be either person?> Yes. <2. Does both men get separate bachelor or both women separate bachelorette parties?> Depends how the respective groups of friends want to handle it. No set rule. <3. Who's big day is it? When it's a man and woman we know it's the woman's day.> It was just OUR day. But it reminded me of a funny story. Straight friends of ours who had gotten married a couple of years earlier recommended a photographer on Staten Island. We went to the company who employed him and talked to the saleslady. Or rather, I did. Jerry hung back and looked at more samples, thinking he might see a photographer's work he liked even better. The saleslady had the full Staten Island big hair, big nails, big accent - she was like Fran Drescher without the subtlety. After we'd negotiated price and other details, she asked me: "So. Do you want the photographer to go to the bride's house before she goes to the church?" "Um..." I started to speak, but she must have seen the "no" in my manner, because she interrupted and said, "There's no extra charge." "Um..." Again I started to speak, and again she waved off my concern. Placing her hand on mine, she assured me, "Trust me, darling. She'll want it." Figuring that a 6'7" visual aid would come in handy, I motioned towards Jerry and said "I'm marrying him." "Oh..." (Pause. Pause. Adjust hair.) "So. We have many packages and you don't have to decide now..." It was hilarious in retrospect. Like some primal piece of salesperson's training kicked in. It was like: pause... absorb new piece of information... adjust hair... MAKE THE SALE. :)

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